new boys club

Having just come through town and seen the new boys club it must be the most hideous building I have seen planted in our town center,the club itself is a good idea but that building uggh.

Anyone got any photos of it?

Looks like a glorified warehouse

Looks like a glorified warehouse

Never a truer word spoken

It will be easy to turn into flats.

Now now FP...

Artist's impressions of the Wigan Boys and Girls Club:

here and here.

i remember the old one at Newtown so it's got to be an improvement

a state of the art, purpose built youth centre in Wigan opening in Spring 2013.

Open to any young person aged 8-21. All welcome!

www.wiganyouthzone.org

Pictures of every sport on the hoardings....exept RUGBY.

I would,nt have thought they would have no provision for rugby as Dave Whealen is a rugby fan.

Well if you didn't sign the petition against it you wanted the club to be built there; so you're lumbered with it, so stop whinging you've got what you wanted.

The one at Soho Street was a modern building at the time, and wasn't it opened by Frankie Vaughan.

Hear hear, Ayrefield.

The building and its location might be controversial, but, now it's there (almost), hopefully the Wigan Youth Zone will become a very constructive part of Wigan life.

For the last few decades, the young of a town have to congregate somewhere so I think it will be brilliant for all the young people of Wigan.

'Wigan Youth Zone is due to open in a matter of months, on the link below you can find details of all vacancies within the staff team.':

Jobs

'The Youth Zone will play a huge role in our local community, and so we want people from all walks of life within the borough to join us as part of our volunteer team.

Our requirements are simple; we ask all volunteers to be 18 or over, and we ask that they commit to going through our detailed volunteer training programme.  This training will be conducted at the Youth Zone itself before our doors are open to the members.  We also ask that volunteers commit to a minimum of 1 x 4-hour shift per week.'

Volunteering

Wigan Youth Zone Progress - Photo-a-day

Wigan Youth Zone's climbing wall

Latest Developments On Site

as great architecture goes this should have gone.
looks like some apprentice scribbled the design in his /her dinner hour

Yuck

Said in Sept it looked like a warehouse and i am convinced it was designed like one

Easier to convert, Peter.

Wigan Youth Zone Vacancies

You can compare the architectural designs of the Youth Zones in Blackburn, Carlisle, Oldham, Manchester and Wigan here.

I got into trouble on that P-A-D.....something about paving I think......someone told me to bugger off back to Wigan.......

THE FUTURE

'Failed Youth Project' - I hope not, Hotwaterpastry - I'm giving it the benefit of the doubt.

I've just checked the P-A-D comments, Lizzie - don't let them get to you.

I reckon with a £5 joining fee and just ten bob entrance it will do just fine.

.......and £400,000 per year from Wigan Council!

"hindleyite

I reckon with a £5 joining fee and just ten bob entrance it will do just fine."

Wanna bet? For a start its in the middle of town. Any idea how many kids it will need to make it viable? At night it will be like a ghost town as enough kids wont want to travel. During the day might be different because the college is across the way.

if it keeps the scrotes off the streets,worth every penny.

Yeah well the scroats aint gonna travel all that way and back again 7 nights and day a week

For a start, it is a Blessed Awful Ugly building..

The problem as I see it is... The 'scrotes' as hindleyite calls them are not the kind of kids that would be interested in going to a youth club.... a place where they could learn something... plus... How are all these kids supposed to get there... if they aren't old enough to make their own way there, will the parents make the effort and take them..If kids are hanging around on the street causing mayham, they have the kind of parents that aren't going to be interested in taking them. So just how many will go and how many is needed to make it viable...

I also think that 21 is too old, they aren't youths at that age, they are young adults... Maybe the 21 year olds could be trained as youth counselers, but there again you have to find the youths/young adults who would be interested..

I have to admit, I am feeling very cynical about this, I don't think it will work, I don't think it is meant to, I think it is a way around someone getting what they want, when it couldn't be got any other way... The only good thing about it is, jobs for some people, jobs now whilst it is being built, jobs when it is being demolished and more jobs when they start to build what was originally intended

jouell
i get more and more cynical when previously very hard nosed business men turn into knights in shining armour.

But baker boy, will they still be knights in shining armour when the truth comes out... they will be found out at some time...Sad thing is, it's the MONEY that talks and money always finds a listener...

To be perfectly frank its a really good idea and where the money and support comes from isn't important.

BUT

£5 is a lot for kids and 50p entrance might seem cheap but thats only if they go for one night. If its expected the project is to keep the kids off the street then the entrance fee over a number of days then adds up BUT then if they travel by bus you have to add in the bus fares.

IMHO its doomed as its not been thought through properly

If it was a project meant for adults position is not really important as most adults travel by car but kids dont and I think this has been forgotten.

Then the other factor, is whats on offer enough to keep kids going back NIGHT AFTER NIGHT? Kids quickly get bored with the same old same old. Whats available should be fluid and change to keep interest. I am old enough to have seen loads of youth clubs, projects and similar over the years start out with a bang then quickly wither and die.

Wigan Youth Zone is to feature on tonight's Granada Reports - @WiganYouthZone

A warehouse with beautiful sequenced coloured lights at night.( NOT)

Another fine WIGAN INCOMPETENTS blot on the landscape. Still, paid for a few nice meals for smiffy and his cohorts with the backhanders they took.

Twice!
Corruptibles!

I just hope that quite a few kids get into it and tell their mates about it. I may be living in Cuckoo Land but hopefully it can be just the thing that Wigan's youth are looking for

Hotwaterpastry, it's worked in Bolton. Why not in Wigan?

I dont know

Has it long term?

I dont know WHERE they placed it for a start as it might be in a centre of an area with a large population and not the middle of town like Wigan.

I'm not saying it wont work just that the signs are not to good

I hope it works for the kids.....it is so important that they have somewhere to go......

www.boltonladsandgirlsclub.co.uk - History:

"The Club was established in 1889, during a time of great industrial and social change ...

Initially, activities and sports were the mainstay of the Club, first athletics and boxing and then gymnastics and football ... Over the years, the Club’s service has expanded to include enterprise projects helping young people into employment, creative arts projects, outreach services on the streets of Bolton and our award winning mentoring project.

... today we work with nearly 3,000 young people each week providing them ‘somewhere to go, something to do, someone to talk to’."


@WiganYouthZone (last night):

'Looks like we'll have to wait to see our TV Report. Check it out soon - interviews with Latics and Warriors managers and skippers'

Had a look and its looks good.

Im not trying to be negative but Wigan isn't Bolton and the Bolton club is self financing as far as I can see although I may be wrong.

Its the biggest in the COUNTRY and there could be many reasons why its so successful. Transposing a success story from one place to another wont guarantee its success here. It must have been tried in other areas so what happened to them?

It's the same company (charity), I should imagine it will be run the same way.

but it doesn't mean it will work because the same conditions that apply in Bolton dont apply here. The town of Bolton for instance has twice the population of the Town of Wigan. Another factor is who is running it. If its numpties who are appointed by the process of who you know and not what you know then thats failure from the start.

If the project has been concieved, run and organised by the same people who ruined the town centre I would not have much faith in this

If I didn't know better I would think that you wanted it to fail just so you can crow "I told you so"

I wouldn't crow .... I would just say "I told you so" I dont want it to fail at all.

Your attitude is the one of an ostrich. You dont want to see any problems so you dont. When things dont go right you blame everyone else but yourself but the blame is you for not taking heed of the warnings.

Its this easy .... if you haven't got an answer for the problems pointed out then you have not planned it properly or thought it through. Ignoring problems wont make them go away they just get bigger

another thing. All the warnings about concerns regarding the town centre and the number of supermarkets within the towns limits which were ignored have become fact with the mess thats there for anyone to see.

Who pays for the mess? We do through our council tax. Apparently this project is getting £400,000.00 pr yr to run from the council ... I wonder when that will increase? We all know about goverment projects and the way the costs bear no relation to the original figure by the time things get going

Do you have six numbers for tomorrows lottery seing as you seem to have some kind of insight into ther future.
Dismissing something that has not even arrived yet as a failure is ridiculous,give it a chance.
There is a difference between "not seeing any problems" and going out of your way to find them at every turn.

I have not dismissed it as a failure completely its just there are more questions than answers .... simple.

"and going out of your way to find them at every turn"

There should be no problems to find without answers to them so if I find problems at EVERY TURN then I would suggest there are indeed a lot of problems.

Hotwater Pastry said, "The town of Bolton for instance has twice the population of the Town of Wigan".

How do you know that? Where is the information? Unless you mean BOROUGH, not TOWN, and then you'd be wrong because Wigan 'borough' has a higher population figure.

I mean the town

Wigan TOWN

Bolton TOWN not quite twice

Try goggling ... or even googling.

No figures for the population of Wigan town exist!

The population figures quoted are the population figures of the 'pre-1974 County Boroughs of Bolton and Wigan'. ie: 81,000 is the population of the towns of Pemberton and Wigan.

Does it not?

Go and add them up

Link

There's no mention of any 'towns' there. It says, Wigan South and Wigan North. They are, clearly, census 'areas'.

There are population figures available for Wigan 'County Borough', Wigan 'Metropolitan Borough', Wigan 'Parish' and Wigan 'Urban Area' (which, incidentally, includes Skelmersdale!), but there are no population figures available for Wigan, the 'town'.

The council estimate around the 35,000 to 38,000, but they've never done a census for Wigan alone.

81,000 people wouldn't fit into Wigan!


PS: Clues can be found in the council's 2011 census report ..... ie:

1) The average ward population in Wigan on 27 March 2011 was 12,714.

The 'town' of Wigan consists of Wigan Central ward, PART OF Wigan West ward, PART OF Douglas ward and PART OF Aspull, New Springs and Whelley ward.

The total population, going off the 'wards' in Wigan 'town' can be 'estimated' as follows .......

Wigan Central ward - 11,712
Wigan West ward - 13,414
Douglas ward - 12,892
Asp.,New Spgs. & Whelley ward - 12,728

So, the total population for the four 'electoral wards', of which 'Wigan town' is contained, is 50,746.
That is taking the WHOLE of the wards of which only PART is in Wigan town. The total for Wigan 'town' will be considerably less, so, the council mustn't be far out with their estimate of 35,000 to 38,000?

(Population figures taken from HERE!)

Then get things really simple eh?

Wigan town is SMALLER than Bolton. Its ability to attract people into its centre is considerably less hence great swathes of commercial property empty.

However you play with the figures Bolton is bigger. I used to work there for a start AND CAN SEE its bigger.

Back to the new club.

I dont want it to fail, nobody wants it to fail but just because it works in Bolton were they have 100yrs of practice running it doesn't mean it will work here. It is not Like for Like and I could be wrong but IMHO its in the wrong place. The people who use it will have to travel and thats the big issue. Its okay for 1 or 2 nights a week but if the prime objective is to keep kids off the street then it will fail in that. Projects like this are targeted at the disadvantaged so they will be the poorest. When somebody says its ONLY £5 and 50p entrance these kids dont have it OR the bus fare to travel mosts nights even if they want to. When I was a kid I would have sooner hung around street corners with my mates living a Mis spent youth than travel every night.

I suspect that even if its a success in getting the numbers in they wont be the kids except for a few that they are really after.

This isn't about the population of Wigan V Bolton. What are the figures for the Wigan B&G club at present?
Whatever they are, hats off to the Con-cil for their innovative design ideology.

Hotwaterpastry has changed his tune from the population of Wigan and Bolton to which is the biggest town, Wigan or Bolton.

But, what's the council got to do with it? It's all the work of the company / charity, Onside!

@tonker

I haven't changed anything ... Bolton Town is Bigger than Wigan Town so where have I changed?

Whats the council got to do with it??? As town says £400,000 and is that per yr? and will it go up? are they guarantors for any debts or cost overuns? are they committed to a long term financial support however successful/unsuccessful? Will it be another white elephant were costs are an increase in your council tax? THAT'S WHAT IT HAS TO DO WITH IT.

@ hotwaterpatsy,

"where have I changed?"

you've changed from the population figures of the two towns, to the size of the two towns.


@ townofmammaries AND hotwaterplasterer,

"Whats the council got to do with it???"

"subsidised to the tune of £400,000 by the council?"



Well, Mac said, "hats off to the Con-cil for their innovative design ideology".

What he should have said was, "hats off to Onside, for their innovative design ideology", because it's not the council's idea, it's theirs.
The charity runs off donations from many sectors. The council are not 'subsidising' anything, they have pledged an annual donation to the charity, as a 'patron'.

In a nutshell, if Onside didn't exist, neither would Wigan Boys and Girls Club. It's not, as some of you seem to think, a 'council project'.


Re: the council's donation of £400,000 per year. This, according to Onside, is only 40% of the annual running costs of the club!
What on Earth can £1 million a year (£20,000 a week) be spent on in a youth club?

I said originally that Bolton Town was twice the size of Wigan town. I night have mislead myself with the figures but its still twice.

"because it's not the council's idea, it's theirs"

They give the planning permission.

"What on Earth can £1 million a year (£20,000 a week) be spent on in a youth club?"

Yeah what?

"In a nutshell, if Onside didn't exist, neither would Wigan Boys and Girls Club. It's not, as some of you seem to think, a 'council project'."

In another nutshell if Wigan Council did not exist neither would Wigan Boys and Girls Club.

Its a joint project.

Tell you what though it would be interesting to find out WHO OWNS THE LAND AND BUILDING NOW in a prime town centre location. If the project fails and Onside own it and have been putting as much as £600,000 pounds in, if it fails after a couple of years or so then there is a handsome profit on selling it on and even a bigger one if they have put less in.

Might be interesting that as it would be a ready made CUSTOM sports centre for some enterprising entrepreneur if you get my drift.

"I said originally that Bolton Town was twice the size of Wigan town".

No you didn't! You said, "The town of Bolton for instance has twice the population of the Town of Wigan".


"They [the council] give the planning permission".

They couldn't refuse planning permission. They are under instruction from Cabinet to put to use, or dispose of, any assets which stand idle.

"In another nutshell if Wigan Council did not exist neither would Wigan Boys and Girls Club".

There are lots of properties in Wigan which could have been bought by Onside, through it's patrons, that would exclude the Council.

"Its a joint project".

No, it's not. The council are not partners, they are patrons.


"WHO OWNS THE LAND AND BUILDING NOW"

The council owns the land. Onside own the building.
If Onside's project fails, the lease reverts to the holder of the head lease. That's Wigan Council.

If Whelan takes the lease on, I doubt it will be on a 'peppercorn' rent basis.

You "doubt it", tonker. i "Suspect" it will, and Drumcroon will be thrown in for a pittance.

Look tonker your playing with words .... anybody shoving £400,000 in a project is a partner.

Yeah thats rit twice the size of population and it wont be far wrong.

"
There are lots of properties in Wigan which could have been bought by Onside, through it's patrons, that would exclude the Council."

Whats that to do with anything?

"If Onside's project fails, the lease reverts to the holder of the head lease."

The lease reverts to Wigan council? The lease for the land? Leases can be sold on and without seeing the lease I cant comment.

Bloody shape-shifter, you!

Here!

not even in the fine print

OnSide are acting in a consulatncy capacity to Wigan Boys and Girls. OnSide are a company formed by ex-employees of Bolton Lads & Girls Club.

Wigan Boys & Girls Club is a registered company limited by guarantee. The directors are D. Whelan, M. Ainscough and W. Ainscough they also act as trustees in addition to D.J Fairhurst.

The directors confirm they have a signed contract with Wigan council to provide 40% of the future running costs.

They also have a pledge from individuals to donate the remainder of the first years running costs.

The company have a 125 year lease on the land at a peppercorn rent.

Offically eight potential sites were provided to OnSide, the Council let OnSide choose the most suitable location.

Unofficially if wasn't the Mesnes Field....no club!

So there!

Theres nothing like facts to clear things up

"Unofficially if it wasn't the Mesnes Field .... no club"!

As hotwalterpastegg said, "Theres nothing like facts to clear things up". And, as that one goes to show, Onside had the upper hand on that one.

The 'Government Property Unit (Cabinet Office)' has it all stitched up!

but if you want to push it there could be a lot of NEW questions but I have had enough of this thread

From @WiganYouthZone on Twitter:

'Wigan Youth Zone will be officially open at only 50p per visit from 8th June. Please help is spread the word. Thanks.'

'Martinez: "It's something to be very proud of in Wigan as a town."' - Photo link

'Wigan Youth Zone want sport volunteers, & others, to work with 8-21 year olds at our brand new facility' www.wiganyouthzone.org

I passed the Youth Zone building recently and now it's almost finished think it looks quite impressive - I like all the warm red brickwork & its modern contrast and think it looks great in its setting.

From Twitter:

@WiganYouthZone We're recruiting again! Loads of amazing F/T and P/T jobs available on our website - please spread the word!

www.wiganyouthzone.org (see jobs section)

Volunteers still needed, too.

Wigan Youth Zone featured on Granada Reports last night - link