Miners: Good Men: True Or False...?

It seems that these fellows think the Universe owes them a living...

Lots of bluff merchants claiming all kinds, and living a good life on it...

What really went on down there in the dark and dismal depths...?

The Pit Ponies could tell a real story...

I guess time spent working underground would enlighten the skeptical amongst us.

How can anyone who has never worked down a mine make a comment?

I know lots of men who worked underground, and there are conflicting stories of what life was like down there.

This is an open thread, not a biased one.

I speak with experience of what some of them tried to claim for after these mines shut.

good luck to the miners,they deserve the very best of everything Lions every single one of them, a plague on Thatcher and her vegetables in the cabinet

Lots of them made false claims. And got away with it...

My father was a miner and I remember many the time there was a knock on the door to say there had been a roof fall, he and his colleagues would have to wait hours to be dug out, not an enviable job at all, and he died at an early age possibly brought on by working in those awful conditions, I've known many miners whose chests have been ruined by coal dust and suffering through being unable to breathe properly, so yes I agree they should be compensated.

of course they should be compensated ,many of my ancestors lost their lives .to keep the home fires burning so to speak ..not a job many would do today .

Posted by: britboy (1647)
I guess time spent working underground would enlighten the skeptical amongst us.

Replied: 5th Aug 2011 at 04:30
Last edited by britboy: 5th Aug 2011 at 05:51:06
Edit

As you all can see from the muted but to the point reply above that I decided to let the members of WW deal with this thread spawned out of ignorance of working underground.

I can speak from first hand experience having worked underground at various centres ...Summersales, Chisnal Hall and Parsonage.
Am I bias, dam right I am, miners are the salt of the earth, valiant to a man. I saw my father-in-law suffer and die from the effects of dust on the lungs after many years underground.

Although people are entitled to their opinion, first hand knowledge of the subject matter in this case is a must!!!

I have seen fit men in buggies with apparatus for breathing etc, etc...

Then go boozing till midnight...

I worked on lathes screwing Acme threads too fine tolerances...Under pressure at 20 years old, on nights...I don't want any medals...

Neither do I claim for deafness or skin disease...

My point is: a lot of these men made thousands of pounds out of false claims, because, of course, they were miners. And got away with it...

Coal and cotton brought wealth and jobs to Wigan and Lancashire for several generations.God Bless all those men and women who toiled in the factories and pits and created a better life for me and my generation.

Welcome back,Jarvo.

I agree with your last post,Dave.

Graft? Not quite sure what you mean on that one?

How do I know, I never saw them at work. Did you?

But I've seen young mothers on lathes doing piece work, working bell to bell, for eight solid hours in noisy, smelly conditions and earning low money...

That's graft!

Jay: It's good to be back on the back benches...

so was grafting in a noisy weaving shed jarvo, i know i did it and now suffer from partial deafness ,i cant claim compensation too long ago .so i put it down to occupational hazzard ,some of your points i can see what your getting at . but having said that what jobs where there in those days ,pits and mills ,maybe what your reffering to is before pits closed down alltogether and they had showers etc more safety precautions ,lots of men lost their lives in pits god rest their soul .they were the salt of the earth

it must have been an awfull job but on a lighter note Jack never turned up on Mondays the boss asked him why he only worked 4 days a week he said because i cant manage on 3

the working man

The compensation schemes were funded with the miner's own money. It was a scandal which should have been brought out into the open. £3 billion was taken from the miner's pension funds to pay the compensation claims. The 3 billion and much more besides should have been paid directly to avoid the creaming off by the 'bent' solicitors.

I have always said after working underground that I could work anywere because nothing compared in the workplace like working in such poor conditions.
I believe the members of WW have quite rightly had their say!

And that includes ALL members!

Where did you get this impression? I have read this thread and not seen anyone say anything resembling a strong remark like that.


"Seems like there's only the 'elitist' who think the miners were scumbags. Bet they look down their noses at bin men as well."

Yes I can read that. That was only people giving their opinions but no reference to "scumbags" I wouldn't have worked down the Pit for a Kings Ransom but that doesn't blind me to the fact that in latter years a lot of ex-miners have claimed a lot of things. You only had to stand in a taproom and hear them discussing their various claims. Please note that I am not saying whether they deserved the claims or not!!

If that is your interpretation then I bow to your superior knowledge. I have never heard that connection. In answer to your question it leads to Adult discussion on the subject!!

Are Miners any different to any other ocupation in terms of making false claims?
Why single out Miners?
I'm sure there are plenty of Lathe twiddlers that have made false injury claims

My dad spent 2 years on his back in hostpital due to being burried under a roof fall, he had a tube in his back to drain his lung, I also saw my workmate get his pelvis crushed & ended up in a wheel chair,he had to fight for compensation,,I think a few months working undeground would help Jarvo, My father in law died due to dust on his chest at the age of 49,

Javo
Imagine if you can.
A coal face that is one foot high and 300 yards long and you are the electrician that has to crawl all the way up the face to change a cable that has been crushed by a roof falling up.
( this what it was called when a roof collapsed). You would have to climb over rocks machines and anything else that was in your path. Now then when you got to the top you would have to repair the cable that was broken and if it was something else as well then you may have to go back down the 300 yards on your knees to get what ever was required. Oh forgot to say that you would have to carry a full kit of tools in temperatures that was very hot and rely on people giving you the correct message so that you would only carry what was needed for the job .
This was one of the easy jobs some for an electrician were very hazardous to say the least.
The only food and water that was available was what you carried and if you missed the train into the face then you had to walk 3 miles carrying tools,water,food and spares that you needed.
The coalface workers had a lot more rough time than this.
They had to be at the coal face by 7am so it was down the pit by 6am, travel to work at5am.
So when you were having a nice time working on a lathe they were working in conditions lots would not even think about.

I Have done this as I worked down the mines for 8 years and when I left I said that people would have to burn wood before I would go back down.

Jarvo is right! But, first, we must distinguish between 'miners' and 'mineworkers'.

I was at the NCB for 12 years. 6 of those were spent underground. The rest mainly on the surface and in the shafts. But, I wasn't a 'miner', in so much as I never 'mined coal'.

As for 'graft' and 'hard work', yes, some 'miners' worked hard'. Some 'mineworkers' worked very hard too. But, for every one who did, there'd be half a dozen who didn't!

As far as claims are concerned, all members of the NUM and allied unions, past and present, were advised to to fill in the forms and attend various clinics for tests related to a few industrial diseases and injuries.
The main three claims were originally for chest, fingers and ears. Later, it included knees.

I claimed for the first three myself.
Chest? Nothing wrong with it!
Fingers? Nothing wrong with 'em!
Ears? Pardon? I said 'EARS'! OK, you don't have to shout! Well, they said I was a bit deaf (even though i insisted I wasn't) and, as a result, they paid me a bit of beer money.

BUT, all those payments were to get themselves 'off the hook' as such. Because, once you've been tested and paid out, on what could show up in later life as a 'long term illness', there's nothing more to get.

Some lads who had never grafted as a miner ended up with five figure sums for vibration white finger. They all followed the same procedure during the test and all gave the same statement as witnesses for each other.
Can you see an electrician drilling holes in rock?
They cheated. Good luck to them.
A lot of miners who worked underground for forty years or more, got nothing.

Tarby, I've been on, and seen, a few coal faces, but never one A FOOT HIGH!

(edit: changed Jacko for Tarby)

I don't think jarvo would have survived the descent in the cage never mind anything else

Millions did. Why shouldn't he?

The Cannel mine was on average less than one foot thick
This was the lowest coal seam worked east of the Irwell Valley. Cannel was used to make coal gas.

but then again if Tonker hasn't seen it it mustn't exist

Spent 20yrs down the mine started of has a haulage man then faceworker then shotfirer/deputy.Class myself lucky No industrial deafness,vibration white finger,or damaged lungs but ended with osteoarthritis in my knees(miners knee) and am classed as having a 20% disability in both knees.Many years ago I was asked to escort some visitors to the coalface to have a look round,one visitor was of the opinion all miners were idle.After his visit he never called miners again and I am led to believe could not get out of bed for a few daysAnyone who has never been underground should go down the minning museum and experience what it was like put up or shut up

Jarvo
You are entitled to your opinion of course,however I couldnt even begin to try and explain the conditions some of us had to work under. I worked on the coal face for 19 years at various collierys (some privite ones in billinge) then another 14 years as a tunneller for a specialised tunnelling company. I have witnessed lots of serious accidents and a couple of fatalities. I have seen men,including myself, carry on working with busted fingers and other minor injuries, you were considered soft if you tried for an early bath with anything less than a broken limb. As I stated, you are entitled to your opinion but take it from me it was no easy ride. Yes, I have recieved compensation for my varoius injuries, but I believe my ex work mates and I deserve every penny we got. By the way, in my later years I was employed in another industry and I couldnt believe how easy it was to make a living. .

I was on a face which had not experience a waist fall in weeks behind the chocks. It all came down one day while on the face and felt like a hurricane blowing through the chocks, very frightening for a teenager on face training!!!

The miners amongst the WW folk will know exactly what I'm talking about and I'm sure they have many more experiences to tell which could only be recalled from working underground.

My dad was a miner at the wood pit in haydock when he got hurt, he lost his arm and was paralised from his knees down, he had an invalid car which is on the photos of spring street, personally they were very brave men he was only 47 at the time and was only 56 when he died. As far as I know he held up a pit prop while some men got out but the roof came down.

Just the thought of being underground is scary let alone having to work there brave men

I watched the men in my family die young fighting for breath.

Both my grandads were miners, one of which was left with two crushed legs following a mining collapse. He managed with two walking sticks but he couldn't really use his lower body and had a little blue disability car. They both lived to be a good age despite ones disability.

My dad was also a very hard working bin man so I would love to hear your take on them!

aye and the coal men who delivered coal humping them sacks on their backs

Aye. And the canteen cat. Catched mice as big as rats, and the rats were bigger than the cat. Get them claims in!

I wrked down the pit, & on threat of the mines closure, I went & got a cushy job on a Lathe. The easiest job I've ever had.

Once again, Jarvo has likened himself to the starfish you see when a cat walks away from you with it's tail in the air.

wot Jarvos got a Quiff?

Art: Easiest job you ever had?
What were you doing? Parting off?

Good reaction from you WW members. We all work hard; some more than others, but I cannot stand people claming on false pretences. It grates with me. I don't know how the miners operated; was it tough? Maybe...

But like the nurses, there are good and bad...
But read my first post carefully...What did I say?

Did I slam the miners? No...Read it again...

Slowly...

you think they was messing with the ponys

Art has had more jobs than Mr Pastry

re read very slowly...Jarvo do you think pit ponys look attractive in low light??? still cant get me head around what you are on about>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Lots of members of my family worked and died in the mines , most of them did,nt live long enough to makes a compensation claim. Jarvo I think you should apologise for starting this thread.

were theres blame theres a claim i dont blame anyone for claiming

Like I said earlier, Jarvo is right in what he said!

my uncle had one of his legs cut of in an accident in the pitt . and another of my uncles dug with his bare hands to try to rescue the chilldren in abervan ..and my granfather died through the dust and muck in the pits . they deserve all they get i would not go down a coal mine for a thousand pound a day never mind a week ...scroungers in all walks of life ..... and my hubby delivered coal for over 16 years..hail rain or snow.and he also worked on the bins for over 25 years..

My Grandad went down the pit aged 14, he died at 58 from dust on the lungs in 1959. 44 years a pit mon and he never complained and he never claimed.

"Art has had more jobs than Mr Pastry"

Yes I have, but not one of them a shiny arsed job like you do,(badly, according to copmplaints aired on here as well as the press) Sludgy

Wonder if jarvo would post a thread like this if he had ever been down the pit,just being a wind up merchant.My dad suffered from Pneumoniacosis(forgive me if wrong spelling)for many years,was getting a miserly pension whilst still working down the pit and didn't claim anything which he should have done.Anyone who worked down the mine are entitled to everything they get or got

I thought this miserable misguided thread was finished with but I see it is still being revived and quite rightly so, if it was started as a wind-up then it sure backfired on the originator!
Perhaps engage brain before mouth or in this case keyboard would be a far better approach for the originator!

They lived with this everyday and these photo's are from the most modern pit in Lancashire you should have seen it in some pits, Photo's off WW theirs more if you look

As I posted earlier I spent 20yrs underground and worked in all types of conditions.At Golborne colliery there was flooding,very nice working piss wet throu and full of sores from the water and dirt rubbing your skin,going home and spitting blood and dust off your lungs.Other extremes were freezing conditions, dusty and humid conditions.After spending a few months never mind years in some of these conditions working with machinery(noise) no wonder underground workers end up with all sorts of ailments and rightly so want compensating for the suffering they endure and if a few get throu the net and get paid bloody good luck to themNo one sees me when my knees flare up and they look like two balloons and I can barely walk,I have had to curtail a lot of things due to my knees(both knees require replacing but am told to young to have them done)

I was a 6' lad of 18 yes you was still only a lad at 18 in the 50s when I did my training on the yard mine face well 2'6", on my knees all day only coming off once in a shift I've still got the blue coal marks in my knees , only sorry it was the older miners that missed out

Oh Tsk tsk tsk Art, you have let me down there again old son.

I assumed (wrongly it would seem) that a man of your intelligence and standing would not be the sort to fall victim of internet rumour and everything that our unreliable, poor quality and extremely biased local press chooses to publish

I was invited to walk down aday hey pit tunnel did not get far leg it out not for me why would you want to be a miners if conditions are as bad as you say

noddy. in days gone bye folks were just happy to have a job .pits and mills nowt else

ecmdi suppose your right ajobs a job but was thinking of more recent times

noddy, most took to the pits in recent times , cause there father and his father worked in mines , tradition which continued for a long time till closure .understand where your coming from

Dougie, The lad in the 2nd pic,with the big smile wearing glasses, is the nephew of my Mrs.
The uninitiated may not realise that those crumpled girders used to be semi-circular...'Til it "Weightened" from above & the floor lifted from below....Lovely safe working conditions aren't they?

And to sludgy, the (man?) fom lazy farm.
Why should I believe you, instead of the ex-roads inspector, with more hands on experience than a college book learned kid?

Yes Art and it could have started off something like this, the yard mine had to put the rings on 18" stilts in the main road to take the weight are it could have finished up like the first photo


PS people looking at this photo may think they had lights down pit

That looks like E3. It was a main roadway and was lit top to bottom.

PS: If I've got it right, and that is E3, you'd be near enough under where B&Q is at Winwick and about 3/4 of a mile below ground.

their was no lights in the 50s only at the pitee and the belt exchanges thats why I'm wrong about the lights and we had to walk in and out

...And to sludgy, the (man?) fom lazy farm.
Why should I believe you, instead of the ex-roads inspector, with more hands on experience than a college book learned kid?....

Art... In fairness to Mr Hardman he is out of the loop and at least 10 years behind the times. If he was brought up to speed on the current government and local policies, priorities and procedures that apply in situations such as this I am sure he would as a professional understand the situation fully and appreciate the reasons why it was laid out in the manner it was

As for more hands on experience.....hhhmmmmm....his claim is `over 20 years` whereas mine is `closer to 30` and given his age I doubt his qualifications are as up to date as, or even match mine....Sorry but there you go, yet more incorrect assumptions from your good self

As for believing the WEP???......PLEASE SPARE ME!!! If they said the sky will turn green at midday tomorrow I could name several in here who would have a very stiff neck by 12:15....and by the sound of things you would be one of them

"current government and local policies, priorities and procedures"?

Including the policy of making sure all cars stay stuck behind a bus, with all priority given to the latter?

Care to tell me...... no US!..... all about them then

Go on....see what google says

agreed its a hijack in bad taste