local pit

can anybody out there tell me were the "john" pit was I think it was somewere around the abram area. thanks.

it was between beech hill and shevington.

Standish!

very close to taylor pit.near the war memorial, right hand side of road just before the s/bends going into shevington from the crooke end.

towards the end of his working life my grandfather worked the noon turn at the john pit.when i was off school i used to go and pick his wages up for my grandmother

martland mill.

Martland Mill was a mill, in Pemberton.

John Pit was a pit in Standish!

A mill just on the Wigan side of the SLG/Wigan borough boundary

art do you know the type mill it was water -wind other.i do know you were not around at the time.?

my martland mill is a district,but have been tonkered.

elmos

Historically known as Markland. See old map below.

yes its clear there,so have been gaffered
and tonkered now.i can't win at throw out
can.

I can't understand a person who spends their entire life living somewhere, but knows nothing about the place!

Dog Meeeeeeat!

elmos

The map was posted to show that you were correct. Markland was an historic 'district' of Pemberton at it's boundary with what was the Shevington part of Standish.
If you look at the map carefully you wil see that Markland is roughly in the area we now call Martland Mill.

thanks gaffer, but tonker will prove the maps
a fake with my luck.

Shevington was never part of Standish, it was Wigan Rural..

Go over the Standish border, in SLG, 20 yards & Martland Bridge, opposite Martland Bridge Inn, took you over the canal to the River Douglas (or Asland) bridge. Over that bridge you would be in Martland Mill lane, which was administered by Wigan Borough..
The general locality was known as Martland Mill

Sorry Elmos, the maps are perfectly in order.

Art, Shevington was never part of Standish OR Wigan, or anywhere else for that matter.
Shevington is only part of Shevington and always has been.

Markland (or Martland) Mill, and Lane, were, are, and always will be, all part of Pemberton.
Regardless of the fact that Pemberton was, and is, administered by Wigan Borough.

John Pit was in Standish, not because anybody 'says it was' and not because anybody's Grandad 'used to work there', or because the Wigan bus drove past it. It was in Standish because records say it was.

VIVA LA REPUBLICA DA PEMBERTON!!!!!!!!!!

don't you start utt,whelley's not part of pemberton.
been for a quick bike ride need a lie down now
to decide if i' ve won or lost.

if you've gone to bo bo's,i'd say you've lost

SHEVINGTON, a township in Standish parish, Lancashire; on the river Douglas and the Leeds and Liverpool canal, 1 mile NE of Gathurst r. station, and 4 NW of Wigan. Acres, 1,706. Real property, £7,742; of which £3,500 are in mines, and £330 in railways. Pop. in 1851, 1,147; in 1861, 1,615. Houses, 262. The increase of pop. arose from the working of new coal mines. S. Hall is the residence of J. Tayleur, Esq. There are a free school and a national school.

John Marius Wilson, Imperial Gazetteer of England and Wales (1870-72)

If Shevington is 'on the River Douglas' and 'the Leeds and Liverpool canal', it can't possibly be '1 mile NE of Gathurst r. station' !

John William Tayleur, sunk three pits in Standish Lower Ground. Funnily enough they were known as:
John Pit
Taylor Pit &
Billy Pit (Giants Hall Colliery)

The Shevington Standish Border is the Milldam Brook, which runs down the valley of Elnup Wood, crosses the road at the bottom of Well Brow (S bends) Where Wigan Lower Rd,SLG continues as Wigan Rd shevington.
The Standish/Wigan Border is where the brook runs down the valley between Giants Hall Rd & Beech Hill & crossed the road where douglas Engineering is now 20 yards from the bridge.
Also, Shevington is a parish of it's own, not in Standish parish. A precept they have to pay on the council tax will tell you that

Art, Shevington was in Standish St.Wilfred's parish until the late 1800's, but is now a civil parish on it's own.

Church parish and civil parish are different.

Standish St.Wilfred's was a church parish, which still exists but without any local government authority.
Shevington is a civil parish which has a low level of authority under Wigan Borough.

And, you insist on classifying Standish Lower Ground as a place on it's own. It's not. Standish Lower Ground is a bit of Standish which is lower than the rest of it!

I know it's a village in Standish With Langtree urban district.
What I'm highlighting is that it's a part of Standish which isn't being recognised these days.
Even the political ward has lost the main part of it's name.
Shevington with Lower Ground...I've had a few cross words with a particular councillor over that.

BTW, higher up the hill, Gidlow, is SLG as well.

I wasn't around in the 1800's....Were you?

No!

art
thanks for the history, you are well informed.

Gaffer, Love the map, My Dad worked at Giants Hall and my great grandfather lived in John Pit Houses in 1851.Anyone know where Whitecake Row was ?

Dave

There was a Whitelake Row shown as in Standish with Langtree. Four families living there.

Morning gaffer,

My family were the Aspeys living at number 1, any idea where Whitelake Row was ?

WHICH PIT DID RED CLOGGS FREQUENT

dave

The name changes to White Cake Row in 1871.
In 1891 it becomes the name for a collection of streets which gives it's location.

That's a big row, covering a lot of ground..never heard of it

There was Woodcock Row in Crooke & Throstle Row towards Johnpit, but never heard anybody in t'village mention White Cake Row.
Funny, it doesnt include the Standish Arms Pub, adjacent to Westons

NEVER HEARD OF WHITE CAKE ROW.WALKED ALL THE PATHES AND FIELDS IN THAT AREA.WOODCOCK ROW (BUTTER ROW)I USED TO ALSO DELIVERY IN CROOKE AND S.L.G. UP TO THE S BEND AT SHEVINGTON.

Thanks Gaffer,

That's the family. Richard and Elizabeth were my GG grandparents.Looks as though they might never have moved and John Pit Houses merely became White Cake Row.

According to Gaffers post, White Cake Row, ran from the Old SLG School to the bottom of Well Brow...That's a long-long way

and wet

ollyb
red clogs apparently was at Garswood Hall colliery , which was off Bryn Road , Bryn

I think every pit had it's own version of red clogs pieman.

Johnpit's was,from the pit eye (pitee) there were some old workings towards Martland Mill known as the Walthew House workings, which ran down hill. They were filled with stinking water, so the 'owd 'uns would try to frighten the young lads with that tale of where red clogs lived.
In actual fact, it was,I think, to keep 'em away from the stinkdamp (Hydrogen Sulphide) & blackdamp (Carbon Dioxide) which was down there..Anyroad, it worked

Was Red Clogs related to Nanny Green Teeth

No, he was Owd Itchy Bowlegs' Brother

Don't you mean Owd Bentlegs? He was a fitter on our wash!

PS ... he might have been a real welder!

PPS ... Roy Derbyshire - Roy Derbyshire!

Davep, I think we are related. I'm the Gt, Gt Grandaughter of Peter Aspey, who was an older brother of Richard, was Elizabeth's maiden name Farrimond?

Peter and his wife Mary Ann lived in Crook, and John Pit Houses.

Yes, I believe we are - Brilliant.

Elizabeth was a Farrimond and Richard and Elizabeth were my Gt Gt Grandparents on my Dad's side.

My Gt Grandfather was James Aspey, son of Richard and Elizabeth, and I guess nephew of Peter and Mary Anne.My Grandfather was also James Aspey son of James and Jane Parkinson who never married but had three children.

Richard and Elizabeth moved to Ingram Street and I was born in Newark street.

I am struggling a bit with Richard's father, was he also Peter ?

Richard and Peter's father was also a Peter born approx
1764. His wife was Margaret Glover born approx 1766.

Peter born 1764 father was Joseph b1735, his wife was Sarah Siddon (no dates for her).

Beware though, there is another family of Aspeys who are cousins with siblings of the same name and similar age. I spent ages chasing the wrong tree.

Are you on Genes Reunited Dave? Most of the family are on there.

Yes, the Aspeys are a confusing lot !!. I have seen the family trees with some of Elizabeth's details and need to follow this up now I have my Grandad's details.

I did start on Genes but moved onto Ancestry. I still have access to Genes, what is your tree called ? If its ok with you I'll look at your site Genes and crib some of the details.

Dave

gaffer why did they have three shafts, so close together .why not work from 1 shaft ,surely it was very expensive to dig 3?.did we come to any conclusion as to where john pit is /was?

Micky

The notes from the reverse of the map.

I worked down Johnpit, Taylorpit & Standish hall drift.
I can assure you that Taylorpit & Johnpit didn't "Close" in 1954.The electrical dept for all three were at Taylorpit.
We only moved across the wood to Standish Hall colliery in about 1956.
The tunnel mentioned was from Taylorpit to Crooke, it was a landing still there partway down the shaft, where we installed shaft electrical signalling equipment on all the landings, to replace mechanical "knockers"

Davep

My tree is under the name of Kath Lee, if you put Peter Aspey's name in the search, it should come up with it, as well as a few other relatives with connecting trees.

just before you get on the s bends which lead you to shevington from s.l.g. there is a large gate. (space for a couple of parking spots) if you walk through the gate and up for approx 100 yards you come to now the john pit. it has been flooded and is now used for fishing. a bit further on is the taylor pit