Photo-a-Day (Tuesday, 3rd September, 2024)
The Ginnel
Well before Central Park, Powell Street and Greenough Streets were built this Ginnel was a public footpath from Standishgate down towards the River Douglas meeting up with another path leading from Water Street at the side of St George’s Church.
With no road crossing it appears to have been a pedestrian river crossing located at ‘Weir Footbridge’ across the River Douglas and Mill Race towards Water Heys and on up to Scholes. This Footbridge (perhaps not the original) is still there close to Greenough Street Bridge and Tesco’s.
I would think that the closest road routes out of Wigan over the Douglas at the time were School Lane and Millgate.
PS: For those unfamiliar with the term, a Ginnel is a word in various Scottish and northern English dialects describing a fenced or walled narrow alleyway usually between two buildings. Sometimes in Yorkshire it is also referred to as a Snicket.
Photo: Colin Traynor (iPhone)
Been up and down there hundreds of times to and from the Girl's High School. Surface rougher then though.
Looking behind the phone pole the wall has got a lean on it or is it the angle the photo was took?
I remember going down there to face the wrath of the Powell Street Preacher . ' Every man in Wigan is a sinner ' .
I have been along there many times in the past when attending hospital appointments at Wigan Infirmary, after parking the car on Tesco's car park. (naughty I know but we always did a bit of shopping at Tesco too!), I go up to the hospital on the bus these days. I remember when rows of terraced houses used to have a ginnel part way along the row, which led to the backs of the houses. I like quirky places like that.
As teenagers riding our bikes we would go down there quite a lot in the sixties..
I walked down there a few weeks ago and it looked as if it had been cleaned up.
It was called an alleyway when I went up it.
I remember him well Dave. We used to drink in the Fox and Goose till 2-55 then run like the 'clappers' down Standishgate and the ginnel to Central Park hoping to see the kick off.
Meg, Cyril, if you are looking in today and digressing from this photo, I did access that ‘Who Built Wigan Churches’ web site and found it very interesting. Thank you
I used this path regularly when I was at the convent, but we always knew it as an entry or alleyway, it was never a ginnel, the only ginnel I've ever seen was on a set of Coronation St.
I never heard the word "ginnel" used in Wigan many years ago, although it's common in Bolton. In Derbyshire they're called a jitty.
I had never heard the term myself until about 30 years ago in Shevington but she originated from Bury.
I think the word Ginnel originates from Middle English so perhaps Anglo Saxon in origin.
Only guess but perhaps Alleyway and Passageway both came much later being derived from French following Norman Conquest?
From 1066 onwards the official language for centuries at Court and among the 'new' Aristocracy, Legal System and Church was French with a bit of Latin and Greek thrown in. This was to distinguish the Nobility from the Anglo Saxon peasants.
As the English language evolved many of these Anglo Saxon words are still in common use, most notably in the north of England.
That's why we have so many words in the English language today all meaning exactly the same.
So Endeth the Lesson!
Various words were used to describe it: alleyway, ginnel, pathway, path, entry.
As a kid and teenager, I used the path (ginnel) hundreds of times for different reasons: to and from my grandparents' house, to and from friends' houses, to and from various shops on Greenough Street etc.
When I was a kid, on the right, going down, was the brick wall separating the path from the car park to The Royal Oak and then the netball/tennis courts which, I believe, belonged to the Convent School.
Low down, close to the bottom, there was/is a gate which is for St. Mary's School.
Pauline, when I was a kid, the path was extremely rough (stones, broken bricks and dirt) and was a little uncomfortable when I was on my bike.
Roy, from the Fox and Goose, why did you not go down Douglas Road, then down Colin Street to get to Central Park?
That route would have been shorter and, therefore, much faster.
Colin, excellent photo of a path walked upon by many Wiganers both young and old, and originally I'm sure by hundreds of clogged feet going to the mills, I've no idea as to when it was tarmacadamed but it was very rough and uneven before.
Here's an article written by Graham Taylor of Wigan local History and Wigan Buildings Preservation Trust, it's about Molly Penson who had the track built as a route to her mills at Water Heyes and named it New Road, here's part of the article about this route and a link to the full article at the end:
Molly’s ever growing property estate stretched from High Street, off Coppull Lane, along both sides of Wigan Lane and Standishgate, down as far as the Wigan Bank in the town centre, and from there across to Long Shoot and along the Wigan to Aspull road in Scholes.
In 1828 a public footpath ran from the Golden Cross public house on Standishgate down to the two weir bridges that crossed the River Douglas, and it’s tributary that fed the factories in Water Heyes. This had the effect of dividing the Penson property, leading to problems with trespassing.
Molly's answer was to close the footpath and open a new path at the side of the Royal Oak Inn that led directly to the weir bridges, this in effect ring fenced Molly’s existing estate. The new path was named ‘New Road’. (It is there to this day connecting Standishgate to Hilton Street adjacent to the Tesco supermarket).
the link to the full report:
https://www.wiganlocalhistory.org/articles/molly-penson-the-woman-with-a-mania-for-houses
"Molly’s ever growing property estate stretched from High Street, off Coppull Lane,..."
Cyril, off High Street is Penson Street; possibly named after Molly or her family.
Cyril / Ian, by the sound of it she must have owned more land than the Duke of Westminster.
Fascinating information from you both, thanks.
Are we fools to hold the past
upon whose faces are souls are cast ?
Industrial towns was once our thread
now as gold mines, left best instead
those with rubbers like natures spell
removes its leaves , it cannot dwell
For change is borne it needs no mast
no direction needed , for , already cast
for every change brings us a new
away from comfort , the safe we grew
that was ours , you where mine
made and poured like a special wine ,
Like autumn leaves , whose hands don’t know ,
Nature’s simply says , just let go …
First of all, thank you Cyril for that link. After posting my words about Penson Street, I used the link to read about Molly Penson and I must say, it was extremely interesting - definitely a business woman ahead of her time.
Colin, you are extremely welcome and thank you for posting such a great photo with such detailed information. Yes, Molly Penson was indeed an astute business woman of great wealth - and, this was in a different world to today.
The word ginnel is a narrow passageway between buildings. Only used in northern English dialect, not a word in general use. No known origin but likely to be a corruption of the word “channel”. Surprising what is in a good etymological dictionary these days!
Hello Ian, Penson Street could quite possibly be named after Molly, though the family's Fustian factory was also around there.
I think there is or was a plaque inside the centre at Penson Street about it too.
You were lucky in not having any punctures riding your cycle along that path when it was unmade and you'd definitely have been shaken and not stirred.
All thanks should go to Wigan History Society and Wigan Buildings Preservation Trust and the contributors who write up those fascinating historical articles, as stated Graham Taylor wrote the article on Molly Penson.
now awash with users and dealers on a daily basis - drop offs at the top, users at the bottom - a place to be avoided I'm afraid