Wigan Album

The end of a dynasty.. Frank Ryding started his first shop on Mesnes Street in the early early 1960's. Another stall holder that the council won't have to bother about.. My prophecy that as this rate the council wont need to worry about relocating any stall holders in to their latest WHITE ELEPHANT..They(The council) seem to be hell bent on systematically closing down all the remaining Market Stall Traders. Does anyone seriously believe that building a CINEMA, BOWLING ALLEY, INDOOR GOLF, HOTEL, MARKET HALL...will ever come to fruition???

Ron,

If you said to the Council executives 50 years ago ‘ make a complete ‘balls up’ of Wigan they couldn’t have done a better job if they’d tried. It’s if a Philistinic cult
had brainwashed them.

I put a lengthy comment on this post this afternoon but having problems with computer and it didn't "send", so just testing before I submit it again!

Well, I'll try again! I just wanted to say I am so sad to see that Frank Ryding's stall has closed down. I loved the way Frank, and later his son, put a little paper band around customers' newspapers and magazines so the they stayed tidy and in one piece in their hands or shopping bags until they got home. I bought my Wigan Observer there only a couple of weeks ago and had no idea it was the last time I would do so. I always thought Frank Ryding was a very tall man until he came into Boots' one day when I worked there, and he was surprisingly small....he was obviously standing on a raised platform behind his paper stall in the market! As for the Council....they couldn't run a bath, let alone a town, and are living in Cloud Cuckoo Land! IF the bowling alley, cinema and indoor golf ever materialise, I think they will be a novelty for a while but I doubt they will last and will probably fold within a year or maybe two. If they are a huge success I will hold up my hands and say I was wrong, but I just can't see that happening, and I don't think many Wiganers can. Time will tell.

The new sparking town centre wont be for you pensioners, it will be for the young.
Dont for get it was the old Wiganers who spoiled your town when you started to shop in the brightly lit cheap supermarkets.

Yet another sad moment and proof how the council just let things go if there isn't any money in it. Amazing how something can be built, be all 'Exciting' for the public - Always makes me laugh when you see those signs about an new 'Exciting' development, the ONLY people excited are the ones building it - Then 30 years later, it's a slum and needs to be demolished. How much did it cost for the Bland Arcade, yet it leaks when it rains? How many years before this becomes a slum and get demolished?

As for the 'New' exciting project, apparently one of the features will be a Cinema.

.....A town centre Cinema. Ingenious. How come no one thought of that before??..........................................

Mick, kindly note that is the "young" who have taken internet shopping to their hearts and the "absolute thrill" of ordering "online" and waiting for the Prime or Etsy van to pull up outside their houses ....we "pensioners" MUCH prefer to go into a shop and actually touch the goods we are thinking of purchasing AND trying on clothes before we buy rather than sending away for clothes and having the bother of sending them back if they don't fit. And how old are YOU, anyway, Peter Pan??!!...... 21?....I doubt it. The whole thing will be a White Elephant before it is a year old.

You will also notice, Mick, that I bought my papers and magazines from a stall in the Market Hall, not from the supermarket, (where they are readily available) and when we are at our caravan I delight in buying meat from Drake and Masefield's Butchers Shops in Skipton and Settle as I did fro, MacAvoy's in Wigan Market Hall. Yes, I DO shop at Supermarkets because we have no old-fashioned grocers left.....I was still a child when Supermarkets came on the scene and the grocers such as Morton's, Latimer's, Maypole Dairy were quickly . disappearing.....it was the generation BEFORE mine that opened the Supermarkets. I love to shop in a market or a draper's or a small family chemists or newsagents but I can't conjure them up out of thin air. I hope the young people DO benefit from the "amenities" promised but I am not alone in thinking this will be a huge flop.

I took a picture of this about 5 years ago and it was very busy.I think my generation must take some a lot of the blame for the situation we are in now.Paper shops got a lot of trade from early morning workers at big factories and the like. Most folk bought a paper a packet of fags every day and caught the bus.Then we got cars and this impacted newsagents.We all wanted better things but we had no idea it would escalate so fast and destroy town centres and shops and at the time very few of us cared,so it is not all the youngs fault.

Pw, I can see what you're saying .....times change and we change with them....so much is done in factories etc. by "robots" now, instead of people; we issue our own books in the libraries, (what few libraries are left to us!),and they are now trying to get us to check-out our own shopping at the supermarket, (which I refuse point-blank to do). But Mick got my back up with his comment about us "old Wiganers" spoiling our town by shopping in Supermarkets! Look back to the comments on p-a-d on Thursday 3rd. August, where Mick clearly states that I can always be assured of a civil answer from him.....I'm afraid I don't call his above answer on this post "civil", and I feel justified in sticking up for myself. I loved Wigan and shopped there regularly for food in the market hall and clothes in Marks and Spencer and Debenhams until the powers-that-be took them away from us. I have certainly supported Wigan all my life until they started demolishing it, and now there is nothing left to support. Even Boots Opticians, which I attend, is moving to Robin Park. I agree with Mick Rathe's point of view on our "exciting" new town, and "a cinema in the town centre".....woo-hoo! When I and the other "pensioners" were growing growing up in Mick's "olden days", there were THREE cinemas in Wigan, and they all had a bit of character, unlike the one that has just closed at Robin Park , and the "new exciting one" which will probably have as much character as a bin-bag.

Yes, please distinguish in future between me and someone else called 'Mick'.

wigan is more like timbuktu every day.
who's responsible for this?

Mick Rathe, I agree with every word you say about the condescending adverts for our "exciting" new town and its new cinema. I should have differentiated more between the "Micks" but I think the Wigan World regulars know who I meant.

Don’t worry Mick R we can ‘allus’ tell the difference with t’other Mick who likes walking into fireplaces and causing ‘sparking’ off.
Well said Irene. Pensioners always persevere ..remember that when you are in your dotage..

Well said Ron,if only Wigan planners would spend a Tuesday at chorley market to see what works.

I agree Pete Rammy I went last week for the first time in years. I am just thinking about going today. Although the Market isn’t on …I felt disorientated at first because it’s so long since I had been there. It’s a nice ride on the bus as well from Wigan.
Marvellous how it has been planned and some lovely stalls in the indoor and outdoor markets. It was a pleasure to go there.

I WENT TO THE MEETING IN THE TOWN HALL WHEN THE PLANS FOR THIS 'DEMOLITION OF OUR TOWN' WERE PASSED. OFF HAND, I THINK THE COUNT WAS 13 FOR AND 6 AGAINST? (WHY ONLY HALF THE COUNCIL WERE PRESENT IS BEYOND ME. ON SUCH AN IMPORTANT DECISION???) IT TRANSPIRES THAT 7 OF THE COUNCILLORS WHO VOTED FOR THE CHANGES WERE FROM, LEIGH, ATHERTON, AND TYLDESLEY.
DOWN THE LINE, IN A COUPLE OF YEARS TIME. THESE "COUNCILLORS" WILL HAVE NO DOUBT RETIRED OR WILL NOT BE COUNCILLORS. SO WON'T BE AROUND TO RECEIVE THE ACCOLADES FOR DOING A GOOD JOB!!! OR THE FLACK FOR COCKING UP THE TOWN CENTRE.

Irene your comments are worthy of praise. Well said.

Why mention where councillors were from,at least they were at the vote Let’s have a list of the councillors who did not turn up and their reasons,and I do think it will be a monumental cockup

Why mention where councillors were from,at least they were at the vote Let’s have a list of the councillors who did not turn up and their reasons,and I do think it will be a monumental cockup

I mentioned where the Councillors were from to highlight the fact that Councillors from those areas would. be putting their own constituents first. I bet the councillors at Chorley are rubbing their hands. The demise of Wigan a s a shopping centre, means more footfall for Chorley As is proving to be the case. How many people in the past, would travel from Leigh, and other local towns to shop in Wigan compared to now????

That is what councillors are supposed to do,represent their constituents.

Precisely... their OWN constituents, Leigh, Atherton, Tyldesley, not the people of Wigan. The less shops in Wigan the more people will stay in their own 'neck of the woods'. Even people from Wigan shop out of town now. Not one butchers shop in Wigan .. There are at least 3 in Chorley within a 20 yard radius.

I do not understand why they voted for it.Voted to spend millions in Wigan town centre and their towns get the crumbs.You seem to spend a lot of time for the cause of Chorley more than Wigan.Any road this is not the place to discuss this,I”ll saynomote

With the greatest respect to you who have commented on Chorley market, it’s gone downhill to the market it was years ago. Friday was Chorley market day for me but I only go now when I go to the opticians. Yesterday I went to Blackburn and the market there is great. Plenty eating stalls with a variety of food. Meat, fish etc for sale and the usual various other stalls.

Wigans market was never any good, I remember my mother going by bus to Chorley market every Tuesday in the 50s, and I agree with Linma, Chorley isn't what it was.
On Tuesdays this week I went to Bury Market by bus, train and tram, its still a great market, and today me and the missis went to Bolton market just buy £15 worth of Silver Hake.

There are several butchers in Wigan.

If Rydings were that keen on continuing their newspaper business, they'd have moved to one of the many empty shops available not a stones throw from the market hall. There's not much to be made selling newspapers.

Confused to say least at the proposed plans to turn Debenhams into Britains largest charity shop. How will this image help to promote the town ?

John Noakes where are they? Dont say Pemberton and Standish. Apart from these two I cant think of anymore in the vicinity definitely none in Wigan town centre

Butchers Fayre, off Queen Street.
Meat Mart, Ormskirk Road.
Halal Meat Store, Wigan Lane.
John Mather's, Ormskirk Toad.

A fair walk from the town centre…

NOT WHAT I WOULD CALL A 'PROPER BUTCHERS' SHOP. ALL PRE PACKED. YOU CANT SEE WHAT YOUR BUYING.

If I want sausages they have to come straight through the machine in the shop and cut from the links. Luckily there’s a shop near me where I live so I don’t need to traipse all over Wigan but I feel sorry for those who can’t do that. The Market Hall was ideal for that with fresh meat as well and it is/was in the town centre.

Is it still a good fish market at Bolton market Wigan Mick, there was always plenty of choice?

The idea of the biggest charity shop in place of Debenhams, well, i wouldn't get too comfy there. Soon as some kind of name looks interested, they'll get turfed out. Remember the £1 clothes shop? They got kicked out against their will, but who was happy to take them? Leigh. And it's doing very well there. As it should, everyone thought it was a great idea - Except the council. Anyone fancy an apartment in old Bryan House? Spend £130,000 overlooking the most urine stenched alley way in town and a disused Chinese restaurant. Only in Wigan.

1. Internet shopping has developed a growth industry in RETURNS ....I'm told there is a big area close to Warrington Bank Quay for re distribution of all that stuff bought on the shopping channel .....in the old days Wigan Mick you just put it back bcause you did not want it.
2. As for the brave New World for the next generation .......they are already watching ALL the cinema they want on Netflix surround systems etc .........they've been playing golf at Augusta and ski ing in Aspen on WII FOR THE LAST 20 YEARS .....dont think yer gonna get them off their own couch and PAY for the same experience do you !!!

That’s very true Philip A.
I have recently sent two items back to a Company that no longer puts a Returns Label or Invoice in a package. I don’t have a printer to print a label so had to email a friend after getting one by email to print it off. What a Faff that was. All in the interests of saving the planet! Whichever way you turn these days it’s more trouble than it’s worth. Everything looks lovely on line but so disappointing if items are too large or not as good quality as they seem. The nearest shop I could take the items back to is at Lytham St Anne’s! So much for saving the planet..plus I am not buying a printer so I can print labels off and using MY paper.
All well and good if what is ordered is ‘hunky dory’. You get to a stage where you can’t be bothered ordering ANYTHING.

There's no such place as Lytham St Anne’s it's either one or the other

Lytham St Annes
“A seaside town in the Borough of Fylde in Lancashire England”
Always described that way.
Yes there’s 2 stops on the train I always call to Lytham first then on the bus to St Annes.
I no longer drive and I find that the best way.

I’ve commented on previous posts about Wigan and other town centres that have seen better days (Bolton, St Helens, Southport).

Wigan is one of the worst by far. I have never seen a town centre so grim and depressing. The sad decline of the market hall is one factor. If Wilko’s pull the plug, Standishgate will have yet another prime site lying empty.

I can see the ‘new’ Wigan in five years will be no better. There will be more social housing flats being built thus welcoming more problems of anti-social behaviour and street drinking.

A bowling alley and cinema is unlikely to happen as the Empire at Robin Park went bust and the Miry Lane bowling alley is just about ticking over. Why build another one, less than half a mile away?

CJ

CJ Exactly what I've been saying from Day 1

i have'nt been into wigan for over 3 years,i do most off my shopping in Ormskirk,still have the market on,2 days a week,on fridays it's earlstown,i know for people who do'nt drive it would be hard,still good old fashion shops,anywhere is better than wigan.

Did you really mean it when you said Wigan market was never any good or was it a joke , or did you mean the one that exists Wigan Mick? I dont live in Wigan permanently, however, when I do go there I buy lots of things from the market. In fact anything that is available there then i buy it, whether food or whatever. Just outt of interest do you support the market? I am not being facetious.

Compare the pictures on the hoardings around the bomb site that used to be the Galleries---old black and white pictures of a busy, bustling town centre, then look at the brave new world colour pictures of what they call 'Preserving our heritage'-. a sterile wasteland that is peopled with happy young families with not a pensioner in sight!!

Quite a few comments on this, I do agree with Ron in that the demise of Wigan as a shopping centre is a planned operation and not just down to the changing habits of shoppers.
Roads into Wigan particular from the south, east and west are chocker and difficult to park when you get here.
The mention of Chorley or other towns such as Warrington are not meant to promote these towns it is quite valid to make comparisons with a dying Wigan and the booming and vibrant town centres they have created.
Most of what is planned for the new build sounds ludicrous, what for instance is a 'Interactive Darts Centre' Do you throw a dart and the board throws it back at you? And a Climbing Wall for goodness sake!!!
A new Hotel when all other hotels except the Premier Inn are either closed or filled with Immigrants (legal or otherwise) or homeless people.
A new Cinema when the one at Robin Park has just closed.
What is planned is no more than a new council estate right smack bang in the middle of town for which they will presumably get a lot of government funding. Why not put this new Council Estate down Wallgate where traditionally house were located with walking distance to the town centre.
The demolition of the very structurally sound Market Hall is nothing less than criminal vandalism, it could be repurposed into a multi purpose venue for theatre, conferences, exhibitions etc.
As you can see I am very passionate and vocal about Wigan Councils expensive and systematic destruction of our Town Centre.

The more I read over all these valid comments the more furious I get, particularly about how the voting took place, not rigged but biased towards the councillors in the west of the borough. Give Leigh the independence they so much want, we in Wigan have little in common.
Thanks Ron, an Utter Disgrace but what can be done and is it too late to stop this vandalism?

Leigh, the tail that wags the Wigan Dog.