Wigan Album

What a fantastic photo! I can remember Penny-for-the-Guy so well! I remember those bonnets too....they didn't have ties under the chin; they were on a hairband which gripped a little girl's head and there was a horseshoe-shaped space at the back to accommodate a pony-tail in her hair. Just look at the short pants, National Health Glasses and gaberdine macs, not to mention someone's Dad's old trilby on the guy and the tan-sad in which he is sitting. This one photo speaks more of a vanished world than a dozen printed pages in a history book.

Bonfire Night.
Penny for the Guy
(A few 'Uncle Joe's' in your pocket)


Remember, remember the fifth of November - went the old nursery rhyme , thinking of that ditty sends me on that well trodden path to times of yore . It's sadly but undeniably true that bonfire night has lost much of its 'glow' it has been greatly diminished by the emergence of Halloween; something almost unheard of in the 1950s apart from its religious significance , ' trick or treat' has largely replaced ' Penny for the Guy' and pumpkins have superseded pomegranates .

Before the Halloween phenomenon ' Bommie night' to children in the excitement stakes was second only to Christmas. The whole 'shebang ' started weeks before the big night. Collecting items of every conceivable sort - old furniture , doors ; flock beds- I remember making regular appearances in the early 1950s , no doubt as people started to buy spring interiors ;orange crates, carpets , anything that would burn and when you think about today old tyres how dangerous was that ! Every ' Bommie ' would have at least one which was used as a crown on the wigwam shaped beacon.

Weeks before the big event it seemed like every corner and been commandeered to house a Guy Fawkes , sat in a ' tan-sad ' or old pram if wheels were not available then Guy would have to sit on the pavement propped up against a wall or gas lamp .Every passerby would be regaled by
' penny for the Guy' followed very politely by Mr.or Mrs. if you were not sure a a lady's marital status ,Miss; you can't risk offending a potential benefactor ! More often than not the youngest of Guys Fawkes's retinue would be encouraged to ask the question, it was obvious even to children that the younger' the child the better the response. An old lady from my street ,Mrs Kelly would always give an 'Uncle Joe's 'or a piece of 'Cough Candy', the same reward if you ran an errand for her.

Far and away the best pitch was outside a pub failing that a shop - you soon realised that you couldn't just set up stall anywhere the fancy might take you , there would be consequences if you did, ranging from your Guy meeting an early demise or your 'bommie 'being 'pogged'
( collapsed ) or worse still a rival gang raiding your stash of flammable pieces to take away in triumph to augment their own pile. Weeks before the 5th lads would take it in turn to guard their precious cargo lest rival gangs would come from other streets to help themselves to your hard got treasure .

Money raised from the ' Penny for the Guy ' endeavours would be pooled to buy fireworks and 'Uncle Joe's Mint Balls' it wouldn't be bonfire night without a few' Uncle Joe's' in your pocket ,
one enterprising shop gave 4 in a little three cornered bag if you spent half a crown on fireworks;
I remember the notice saying ' sparklers do not count to the total ' . All this in preparation for the big night -and it was a big night .Children for weeks had been looking forward the lighting of the bonfire . It was always a Dad who lit the fire often using paraffin as a accelerant! Imagine that today! Enough to send health and safety officer into a spin like a Catherine Wheel ,this type of firework was particularly liked by girls, it would be pinned to a gate or fence when ignited would spin at great speed spilling colours of every hue into the night air , in the process leaving a scar on a gate or whatever had been used as a host .Younger children would be satisfied with a sparkler; older boys were obsessed with 'Penny Bangers ' they did exactly as it said on the packet - just make a bang. Boys would find it amusing to startle each other and would find great delight in placing one behind a group of girls to watch the histrionics unfold , quite cruel when you think about it.'

Another cruel aspect of the night as far as poor old Guy Fawkes was concerned, when amid great cheers his effigy is thrown unceremoniously onto the flames to be engulfed in seconds.
I, along with the vast majority of children hadn't a clue what this was meant to symbolise . I think teachers missed a golden opportunity to use the event as history lesson , linking bonfire night with The Gunpowder Plot .'The plan was to blow up The House of Lords during the State Opening of Parliament on 5th November 1605; it wasn't used at my school, or if it was I must have been too excited to remember , I can (almost) however recall the nursery rhyme in full -

Remember remember the the fifth of November
Guy Fawkes, Guy Fawkes, 'twas his intent
To blow up the King and the Parliament
Three score barrels of powder below
Poor old England to overthrow
By God's providence he was catch'd
With a dark lantern and burning match
Holler boys, holler boys, let the bells ring
Holler boys, holler boys, God save the King!

To the more gentle side of the celebration Mothers would make treacle toffee, a must for that night , pomegranates would make a yearly appearance, another treat were potatoes baked in the edges of the fire as were chestnuts , I think older readers, like me will remember how good they tasted ; bizarrely the soot smudged round your mouth seemed to add to the taste !

When I was a child almost every corner shop sold fire works - separately and in boxes. Better off families with the wherewithal would buy a boxes ,this didn't sit well with boys in the family as they didn't have bangers ; usually a Rocket , a Roman Candle , a Catherine Wheel , a Snow Shower. Traffic Lights and a few others whose names escape me , I can however remember the names on the boxes - Wessex with a silhouette of Guy Fawkes with tall wide brimmed hat looking over his shoulder furtively; I always thought it quite a scary image for children, and of course the old favourites Brocks and Standard . Incidentally bangers were made illegal 1997.

The following day acrid smoke hung over the town , like a wet blanket ,skeletons of mattress and other materials that hadn't burnt in the previous night's infernos, scattered across every piece of spare land. Early risers might even see the drying embers of the fires breathing their last , so to speak. Children would have feeling of anticlimax, the chance to earn extra pocket money from. ' Penny for the Guy' lost for a year. The excitement of the previous weeks gone up like smoke. Still, Christmas to look forward to ,only seven weeks away but to children that seemed an age. Then the realisation that there would be another chance to earn pocket money- Carol Singing !

I am aware that in my younger days the law was not very rigorous regarding the sale of fireworks. The law has been tightened significantly in recent years and in many respects - They may not be sold to anyone under 18 years they must be sold in boxes it is illegal to split and sell separately they may only be sold between- 15 October to 10 November. 26 to 31 December . 3 days before Diwali and Chinese New Year. You must not set off fireworks between 11pm and 7am, except for: Bonfire Night, when the cut off is midnightNew Year’s Eve, Diwali and Chinese New Year, when the cut off is 1am. I know some people will think these regulations are thought up by killjoys but I think the vast majority think the law should be tightened much further, a view I'm sure would be. echoed by all the cats and dogs in Wigan!

I knew you would comment on this photo Irene. The early sixties fashion for children weren't' much different than the fifties. I especially remember the gaberdine macs - Mine was bottle green a nod at St Pat's bottle green uniform. I even had a camel coat( 2nd hand) that my mam had died bottle green and it shrunk! That's a belting guy though it should have won a prize, quite posh with dad's wellies and trilby!

Brilliant Tom - brings it all back...certainly matches the photo with the excitement on the children's faces.

Irene I used to have a gaberdine mac when I was a child it was navy blue, also my dear old grandad always wore a trilby in the 60s and 70s . Men who wore trilbies were proper gentlemen in those days.

Predictive text - the blight of technology - should be 'dyed' a coat not 'died' !

When you think about it,Catholic schools probably didn't include it in the history curriculum as it was a thwarted attempt at terrorism
I can remember Bonfire nights so well,exactly as you describe. I only clocked after a couple of years of my own son contracting some mysterious medical 'complaint ' and having a day off school that he was guarding the bonnie for his mates,who took it in turns,this was back in the 1980's !

Looks a bit like the old houses on Castle Rise,off Chapel Green or Bridgecroft Street,both long gone.

Tom , that penultimate paragraph is glorious . A perfect description of the 6th of November as I recall it in the mid/ late 60s , with rocket sticks stranded on roof tops for weeks after and the charred wire remains of sparklers strewn everywhere .

Tom , You give a fantastic story of bommie night as we called it.,lovley composition.

Only day that mattered , that lasts until this day , collecting for our bommie ,
Covert childhood play .
Who could build the biggest ,
How long would it burn .protect your bommie with your life ,
The first law you would
learn .
Dead of night you’d venture ,
to raid a bommie stack ,
Under cover secrets ,
Get in and then get back .
The build up was intensive ,
as bommie work must be ,
With Guy you’d been collecting ,
But sadly burn would he .
Done his part and parcel ,
The bommie took the claim ,
School work out the window ,
As the bommie took the brain .
Keep your Father Christmas ,
The snowman , robin lark ,
Nov 5th is Bommie neet ,and my childhood in the dark ..

Tom. I was interested in what you said about Halloween. I grew up in Scholes in the 1950s and 60s and Halloween was a very big thing. Certainly not in the American sense of trick or treating or Pumpkins. Instead it's was all about dressing up, having parties and certain foods like treacle toffee and parkin.. Bobbing for apples was essential. Incidentally whenever the issue of region comes up, we had Halloween Parties at both my CofE primary school and Sunday school ! Perhaps less surprisingly less than a week later we were up for Bonfire Night. Our Bommie was on the space ground in Rupert Street opposite the old St Pats school.

Lovely story Tom, you've certainly got everyone reminiscing. Really good memories...If you couldn't hide some boomy in your back yard.You couldn't be in their gang. (Emotional blackmail)

The space between the houses on Rupert St Carolaen - opposite the Girl's school , I don't know how you got away with that! The house nearest to the 'Bommie' going down Rupert St lived a girl I was at school with. The gap wasn't all that wide if I remember, actually it's still there and the houses on one side.

'My childhood in the dark' . The magic of fireworks night brilliantly evoked in five words . Superb f .

Veronica. I'm talking about the wasteland that was created when they knocked down some of the houses in Rupert Street and on Hardybutts probably around 1960 ? The land was derelict for a few years.

I agree with Poet, f. "My childhood in the dark" sent shivers up my spine. It sent my thoughts winging back to a junior school classroom, watching the darkening sky in the days when school only finished at four o'clock, and the teacher called for home-time prayers. Hands together and eyes closed. Never was "Lord-keep-us-safe-this-night-'til-morning-light-appears" gabbled so quickly and so irreverently! By six o'clock we were outside, ribboned plaits covered by hand-knitted bonnets, and there it was....waiting on the night air....the smoky, heady, unmistakeable smell of Bonfire Night. Mams passed around toffee apples and treacle toffee, and Dads, full of importance, lit the bonfire and set fire yet again to the backyard gate with a Catherine Wheel. The old sofa on which we sat eventually joined the flames and we stood, our faces burning and our backs freezing as the night wore on and the fire slowly died. Then, grimy, sticky, tired and happy, we gradually drifted indoors. After all the collecting of firewood and the making of our guy out of my Dad's old overalls and the childhood voices singing along with the advert on the telly, "Light Up The Sky With Standard Fireworks", it was all over for another year. Happy, happy days!

Carolaen, I too love Hallowe'en and was so frustrated as a child because, like Tom, I never heard a word about it and my schoolfriends didn't know what I was talking about! We only had two channels on the telly then....both of them had a teatime programme; one, I think, was Look North and the other was Scene at Six Thirty. I can remember changing the channels regularly during the half-hour programmes to see if Hallowe'en was mentioned, and in those days you had to jump up and switch channels manually....remote controls were a thing of the future! When my children were growing up, Hallowe'en became more popular and I remember making lanterns out of turnips.....they were so hard to carve and stunk to High Heaven! I must admit I hate most American imports to our country, especially Americanisms such as "24/7" and "You Guys", (my bete noir), but I LOVE Hallowe'en.

Oh! Sorry Carolaen I thought you meant in the 50's. There's bungalows on the site where you mean now. It's strange how they demolished one block and left the others..

Our bonfire was on the 'breid' on Vauxhall Rd near the Stocking Factory. I always remember watery eyes caused by the smoke, and you could taste it!
I seem to recall my dad telling me there was a bonfire on the 'breid' when the war ended. It was a popular spot for the bonfires on there, also lorries used to be parked there sometimes.

Veronica ,where you had your bonfire 50 yards further down the ' bried ' was another one I was on that bonfire it was near my cousins house- Lyons do you remember them ? I remember on yours was Norman Parker and Brian Edwards Gordon Cunliffe

Never felt so down,
when bommie night was over .
Never felt so low, to wait another year.
Staring at the now, dying embers glowing,
Rocket in my hand that once was in the sky...

I do remember Tom, the Lyons lived in that little street behind Wellington St. Across the road was more spare ground where the old St Pat's club was. There was plenty spare ground in those days for playing on. I remember Gordon and Brian Edwards but not the other one. There must have been houses at one time all along Bradshawgate. Do you remember at the very end of Stuart St on the left hand side , a family kept pigs? I used to take peelings for them in exchange for toffee. Although I never saw any pigs!

I remember Penny for Guy.....I remember me and a mate wheelin' one into a pub.
The landlord looked at us and said
I'm not servin' 'im , he's already *** !!